Our art podcast guest today is Megan Auman. Megan is an artist, metalsmith teacher, writer, and business coach. In addition to making and selling her jewelry, she helps artists and makers grow their businesses through her books, online classes, and coaching. Now, after Megan reached out to us, I read her book, Try It and See it’s all about mindset shifts to help creatives get things done. I loved the the book. It was a real kick up the creatives for me. And so I was curious to hear more from her. So I really hope you enjoy the show.
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Megans website, books and courses
Instagram – @meganauman
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Megan Auman Podcast Transcript
Tara Roskell
Thank you so much for joining us on the podcast. I wonder if you could start by telling me a little bit about yourself, bit about your background and what you do now.
0:00:43
Megan Auman
Yeah, so I wear a lot of hats. I am an artist, a metalsmith, a writer, a teacher, a creative business coach. In the course of my business, I have done a lot of different things. So I actually went to school for metalsmithing. I have a BFA in metalsmithing. It actually says that on my diploma. And then I didn’t know what to do with a BFA, so I went and got my MFA. And then I thought either I’m going to be a teacher, like, become a full time professor, or I’m going to start my own business. And I was lucky enough to have a full time professor job for a year. And I always joke that what I learned in that year is that I didn’t want to be a full time professor. So launched my own business, started selling my jewelry mostly at outdoor retail craft shows and also a big learning experience because I realized I didn’t want to stand in the tent, a tent in the rain every weekend.
0:01:30
Megan Auman
So I pivoted and started selling my jewelry wholesale. And then not long after that, I started writing a blog called Crafting an MBA, which is now called Designing an MBA. And really just focusing on helping other artists and makers with their businesses because I realized I can kind of geek out about the business side, but there wasn’t a lot of resources for artists and makers, and so I decided I wanted to provide that. And so in the end, it came full circle, and I ended up teaching as well, but teaching on my terms.
0:01:57
Tara Roskell
You talking about standing outside in the craft fairs. I’m going to actually blame you because reading your book actually got me to book to do an art fair. So when I’m freezing, it’s actually inside, but it’s a really old building, so I think it’s going to be cold. That is your fault.
0:02:13
Megan Auman
I will absolutely take the blame for that. And what I will say is that I don’t regret doing those because I learned so much in my business. It helped me understand who my customers were. It helped me refine my product line. There was so much that I learned in doing them. And so I do not for a second regret doing them. I just realized I didn’t want to do them forever.
0:02:32
Tara Roskell
Yeah, sure, I’ll tell you. And that’s what actually reading your thing was why I thought in your book was why I thought I need to try this just so I can actually get in front of people and know what they think. Because social media, you get a little bit of feedback, but not necessarily from the people you need feedback from.
0:02:49
Megan Auman
If that makes sense. Totally makes sense.
0:02:52
Tara Roskell
So I know you now wholesale some of your jewelry and like you said, you juggle a lot of different career hats. I’m quite intrigued by how you got into wholesale. I don’t know if you want to tell me a little bit about that.
0:03:05
Megan Auman
Yeah, so that was actually sort of started as a fluke. So when I was doing a lot of the retail craft shows and art fairs, this was back in 2006 2007 2008 and I was just looking at other artists websites and going, what shows are they doing? And I kept seeing people do this thing called the New York International Gift Fair. And I was like, I don’t know what that is. But I looked and realized it was a wholesale show.
0:03:29
Megan Auman
And I thought, well, I maybe had one or two stores reach out to me on Etsy at that point because at that point I was just selling on Etsy. Because shopify and things didn’t really exist yet. And so I thought, you know what? Maybe I’ll give that a try. So I had read all these things that said when you apply apply for the show, it usually takes you like a show or two to get in. So it was November and I thought, great, I’m going to apply to the show. I’ll go walk it in January and I’ll do it in the summer. And they called me in November and said, we have a booth in the January show to feature a new jewelry artist. Would you like it? And I said, yes. And I hung up the phone and went, what did I just get myself into?
0:04:06
Megan Auman
And so I just threw everything together. I didn’t know what I didn’t know. In hindsight, it was actually a good thing because I know a lot of people will go and they’ll walk the show, which is really helpful, but they’ll be like, oh, it’s too big for me. I can’t start there. I can’t do that yet. And I was just like, I don’t know anything about this. I had luckily walked some other smaller wholesale shows, so I did know how they worked, but I didn’t have a line sheet.
0:04:29
Megan Auman
But I didn’t even have lights in my booth because by the time I came around to thinking about lighting, I was like, done. I was so done. So I just showed up with my jewelry, put it out there, and surprisingly had a very, very good show because I had spent that time doing the retail markets and refining my product line. So I had a really strong product line, and buyers were like, yes, we want this. This is great.
0:04:51
Megan Auman
And so I did that. But I also realized this was kind of one of the things that sent me into teaching in one of the first classes that I ever created was something called Wholesale Academy. Actually, the very first info product I created was a guide to wholesale and trade shows because I got in so many fights with my husband getting ready for that show because there was just so much I didn’t know. And I was like, well, I think I have to do it this way. And he was like, Why can’t we do it this way? Because he was helping me build stuff. And I just thought no one should ever have to go through what I went through.
0:05:18
Megan Auman
And so I was like, I started teaching and coaching and talking about wholesale because at the time, there just wasn’t that much information about it. And yeah, I didn’t want anyone to have that stress that I had.
0:05:28
Tara Roskell
So I’m really curious. You talk about wholesaling, is that more jewelry and products, or do you think artists with vigilance can do that as well?
0:05:36
Megan Auman
So it really sort of depends on the types of products that you’re creating. So typically, if you are a fine artist and you’re doing one of a Kind painting or one of a Kind sculpture, you’re mostly dealing with galleries who are unfortunately still on the consignment model. So it’s just one of those where it’s been the model for a long time. Right or wrong, it’s been the model. And so a lot of galleries will want to take stuff on consignment. But what I’ve also seen a lot of visual artists do is they’ll do spin off lines, so they’ll do prints or they’ll do greeting cards or they’ll do things like that where stores are more likely to buy those types of things wholesale because it’s a different price point.
0:06:12
Megan Auman
So depending on what your work looks like and your product mix, you can certainly make wholesale work as a visual artist.
0:06:20
Tara Roskell
Cool. Now, you’ve achieved a lot of success in your career, but what are some of the biggest challenges that you faced along the way?
0:06:27
Megan Auman
Oh, man. So I will say I have launched a lot of different types of art and product lines that just did not work for me. So one of the biggest things I had done the New York Gift Fair for two seasons with my jewelry, but I really wanted to get into home decor, so I actually my undergrad or not my undergrad, my graduate thesis, I didn’t make jewelry. I made sculpture. I made this big welded wire chair for anyone who follows me on Instagram. Sometimes it makes an appearance in my Instagram post or my Instagram stories. It’s this floral patterned wire chair, completely nonfunctional, but I thought, oh, I love home decor. I would love to sort of do a product line. So I designed this entire product line. I had this big booth at New York Gift and I took it to the show and it was a flop on many levels. Like, my booth design wasn’t great.
0:07:18
Megan Auman
My pricing was off. It was January of 2009, so it was the height of the recession. Just everything about it was wrong. And I got some great press out of it. I had, like, amazing press, but not a lot of sales from that line. In fact, I still have a bunch of pieces from it around my studio, around my house. It’s great. I love it. I use it for different things, but it just didn’t really work out. And over time, I’ve launched other product lines or other types of things where I thought, this is a really cool idea. I’m going to do this.
0:07:46
Megan Auman
And it didn’t work. And what I realized is that as artists and as creatives, we have an infinite amount of things that we can make, but not all of them are going to be our best fit for what we can sell. And so over time, I’ve let myself try different things, but they haven’t always been a success. And we’ve been talking about my book, Try It and See. I never think anything is a failure. I always just treat it as a learning opportunity.
0:08:11
Megan Auman
But I’ve definitely put products out there into the marketplace and had them not work. And I will admit that as a creative, science is discouraging, right? When you put stuff out there, it doesn’t sell. But I always kind of just find my way back home and go back to the things that typically tend to work for me in my business. But then I will also say that with that struggle comes I am just as guilty as any other creative of shiny object syndrome, right? Like, let’s go do this thing. Let’s go do this thing. And I think it’s a challenge and it’s also an advantage, right? Because there are people who are not creative who wish they could do what we do. They wish they could come up with ideas on demand and all that stuff. So in some ways it’s an asset, but then in some ways it’s a challenge when you’re like, oh, I feel like I’ve started every few years. I just want to burn my business to the ground and start something new. Not because it’s not working, but because I’m a creative and I get bored. So it’s always sort of balancing and managing that.
0:09:02
Tara Roskell
Yeah, totally know that feeling. So what ways have you adapted your own jewelry business to make it more profitable? And obviously you still want to get the creative element in. So how do you mix the two.
0:09:13
Megan Auman
Yeah. So, I mean, the first thing is just always making sure that I am priced appropriately. Anyone who has been around me for a long time knows that raise your prices is practically my battle cry. I talk about it in the book. Just making sure that I’m priced so that I’m profitable, especially at wholesale level. So that’s the number one thing. And then realizing that not every product line is going to work well for wholesale. So sometimes I’ll get in moods where I’ll make something that’s like really overly labor intensive or decorative and then I realize like, oh, that’s a really hard sell at wholesale because there’s just a lot of money tied up in the labor time.
0:09:49
Megan Auman
For me, typically that’s where the cost comes. It’s not material cost, it’s labor. And so kind of understanding that that may or may not work, but then also giving myself permission on the creative side to play with things, to put things out on my website, to try some stuff. Just knowing again that not every collection is going to sell, but it’s okay if I have an idea to kind of put a couple of things out there or put things out and test them and see how it goes. So I do give myself time to sort of play and experiment in the studio because I think that’s so important. And then the other thing for me that I’ve really come to realize is that marketing can also be a part of our creative process and it can be a creative act. And so I really let myself have fun and play in my product photography. So one of the things that I have started doing, I started maybe like it’s been maybe like seven years, I started photographing my jewelry on myself.
0:10:39
Megan Auman
I was always using models. I think when you make wearable stuff, it’s so important to photograph on a real human. And so I was using models and I kind of got sick of waiting around for models. So I just started photographing my jewelry on myself and I’ve realized that that’s become a really important part of my creative process. So last year I had introduced some more kind of basic necklaces and things that I just sort of felt filled out my line. And it’s definitely not the most creative work as far as things that I’m doing in the studio, but they’re really great, like everyday basic necklaces. But what I realized was I could have a lot of fun with my product photography. And so I started doing I call it like portraits with plants because I’m also a plant lady. And so it’s just like, how can I photograph this work with all these different kinds of plants and different outfits and things like that?
0:11:20
Megan Auman
And so for me, it’s understanding that part of my creative expression can come through in the marketing as well as in the product.
0:11:27
Tara Roskell
Okay, so that’s how you get over the boredom factor almost, yes.
0:11:31
Megan Auman
And it’s funny because I realized, too, that anytime I am tired of my work, if I’m like, I’m so bored with this particular design, or I’m kind of over this, if I put it on and start taking pictures, I’m like, oh my God, I love this collection again. So it really is amazing how much bringing that creative element into the photography and the marketing totally helps with the boredom factor.
0:11:54
Tara Roskell
So when you are wholesale and you’re actually making all these pieces yourself, or do you get other people to help you with those?
0:11:59
Megan Auman
So right now, I’m making everything myself. I had several years where I had a productionist distant. She worked for me 30 hours a week. She did not work out of my studio. She worked out of her own space, actually in a different state, which made it had its own set of challenges. But in the end, it was the right decision for both of us. And so I had her working for me for a while. And what I realized in that time, there were some pros and cons to it. And I’m always happy to talk with people if they’re thinking about hiring and how to make that decision.
0:12:26
Megan Auman
And I feel like I made a lot of the right decisions when I hired her. But what I underestimated was that for me, a lot of the development of new jewelry comes when I’m in the studio doing the sort of, quote unquote boring production work, because it’s when I’m doing those repetitive tasks, I’m like, oh, well, what if I also try this thing? And oh, what if I also try that thing? And so what happened was, when I had someone basically making all the jewelry for me, I stopped designing jewelry.
0:12:52
Megan Auman
And again, this was kind of that creative, that shiny object syndrome where I was like, oh, let me go off and do this thing, and let me go off and do this thing. But my stores, my buyers were like, well, where’s the new jewelry? They’re like, It’s cool that you’re making paintings right now, but we want new jewelry. And so I just sort of realized it wasn’t the right fit for me going forward. And so I ended up letting her go and taking that part of the production process back. Now, I will also say that I do left wholesale now than when I had her, right? Because part of having an employee for 30 hours a week that you have to pay for is you have to drum up 30 hours worth of a week worth of work a week for her.
0:13:29
Megan Auman
And so I no longer have that. So I do a little less wholesale because I have the other sides of my business, too. I have the books and I have the teaching and I have my online mentorship program. And so I do less wholesale than I used to do. But it’s actually okay with me because the balance feels better now.
0:13:44
Tara Roskell
Sure. And it’s quite strange, isn’t it, that doing those repetitive tasks is when you get creative ideas, I guess, because your brain is just not really thinking, is it?
0:13:52
Megan Auman
It’s just drifting. Exactly. And I think too, it’s sort of one of those where there is something nice about some days where it’s like, I don’t feel like working, but now I can just sit down and make some chain and just zone out, watch some TV, make some chain and sometimes you kind of need that in the business. It’s really hard to be creative all the time.
0:14:12
Tara Roskell
Yeah. So you live in a small town in Pennsylvania, but I read that you love the city. So do you think it makes a difference? Is it harder for artists living in smaller places like myself? I just live in it’s not a very arty little village. So do you think it makes a difference to how well you can do as an artist?
0:14:31
Megan Auman
I think there are pros and cons. So I think about one of my really good friends, another Jeweler. She lives in New York City. And before that she lived in San Francisco and La. So she’s always lived in big cities. And she is so good at meeting people and networking and she’s always at events and she’s always showing off her work and she’s always hustling. But the flip side is it costs her. Like her cost of living is like four times what my cost of living is. And so she has to make so much more money.
0:14:58
Megan Auman
And so it’s sort of like, okay, well, it’s kind of easier to hustle there, but she also has to hustle there because she has to make that kind of money. And so I will admit that there are times we’re living in a small town because my small town is also not very artsy, where I have felt a lot of loneliness, but I also just look at it as an opportunity. How do I connect with people? How do I connect with people online? I can’t imagine doing this before the Internet. I will be totally honest. I think it would have been really hard before the Internet, but now it’s like, oh, I can connect with friends online.
0:15:26
Megan Auman
I have the friends that I’ve met at shows, I have people I’ve met at conferences. I do make it a point to go to cities and travel and go places. I can’t tell you the amount of times where I’ve been somewhere and someone’s like, well, you live in Brooklyn, right? And I’m like, no, I absolutely do not live in Brooklyn. But I’m just always like I try to go to New York as often as I can. And I do have the advantage of being just a couple of hours away from a lot of major East Coast cities in the US. So I’m really close to New York to philly to Baltimore, and that helps as well. But I think the most important thing, whether you live in a city or whether you live in a country, is actually carving out time to connect with people. Whether that’s on Zoom, whether that’s doing a podcast interview, whether that’s meeting people for coffee.
0:16:05
Megan Auman
Once I did realize I had sort of like a creative kindred spirit within an hour’s drive of me, I was like, okay, we have to make it a point to meet up regularly. And then during the Pandemic, we just switched to Zoom chats, and now we’re back to going to get coffee again. So really making it a point to do those things and even just simple little stuff. So we have finally, in my tiny town, like a nice little coffee shop, and they display art. And so during the pandemic, when they were just open for takeout, I made it a point to go and try to order and purchase from them at least once a week because I was like, this is the one place in my town that shows art. I don’t want it to close.
0:16:41
Megan Auman
And so just looking for those little pockets where you live. But yeah, like I said, then, the positive is, like, it’s a lot cheaper to live in the country. I have this huge studio space that I couldn’t afford to have in a city. So there are definitely pros and cons. And also I get more work done because there’s less distractions.
0:16:59
Tara Roskell
That’s true. Now, you mentioned earlier your book, try and see which I have to say I really loved. And I would say it’s like a kick up the bum. That’s what we’d say in England anyway. Kick up the butt, I guess, for the Americans. Can you tell us about some of the mindset shifts that you suggest in the book that are really essential for accomplishing more in a creative business?
0:17:21
Megan Auman
Yeah, so the subtitle of the book is how to get shit done while overanalyzing everything. And that’s really where the book came out of, is this idea that as creatives, we tend to be overthinkers, we tend to overanalyze. And rather than trying to fight that tendency, it’s just how do I get stuff done in spite of it or despite of it? And so really just making sure that you’re being productive. And so one of the biggest things that I kind of talk about in the book is this idea that everything is an experiment.
0:17:55
Megan Auman
One of the things that keeps us from getting stuff done as creatives is that we want to know the outcome. And it’s not just as creatives, it’s as humans, too. We want to know the outcome before we start. We want to know if the Art Fair is going to be a success. We want to know if the store is going to like our work. We want to know if this product line is going to sell. And so we try to think our way into those answers. And the reality is we have no clue. We have no idea if anything is going to work until we do it. And so if you can switch your mindset to think of this idea of everything being an experiment, then you’re like, I don’t know, let me just try it and see.
0:18:26
Megan Auman
And then once I’ve tried it, now I have data and I can go back and I can decide, oh, do I want to do more art fairs? Do I want to do this art fair again? Do I want to try some in different cities, different locations? This product line didn’t work the way I thought it was. Why do I think that is? Do I need to change the line? Do I need to connect with different customers? And so just being willing to put things out there and try them and remembering that nothing is a failure, everything is a learning experience, which I know is really hard if you are a creative who also tends to be a perfectionist. Which is why I also talk about perfectionism a lot in the book too, because that is one of those things that absolutely holds us back. And so one of my rules is never make anything perfect.
0:19:11
Megan Auman
And the idea is, like, you just have to put things out there and you leave a typo in or you launch before you’re ready. And then you realize that the sky doesn’t fall down because the people who are there kind of trying the perfectionist thing and the Polishing thing, it’s a really hard and stressful way to live. And so letting go of those tendencies, I talk a lot in the book about, you know, different tricks for letting go of those tendencies because that’s what’s going to let you get more of your work out into the world. And it’s only when you get more of your work out into the world that you’re actually going to sell and make money and do all those things.
0:19:45
Tara Roskell
Yeah, it was totally for me when I read that you get analysis paralysis, and I totally get that. And it’s silly that you have to have someone tell you, but I have to have you tell me in the book destroy it.
0:20:01
Megan Auman
Yeah. And one of the things I think that comes from analysis paralysis that I talk about in the book is this idea that we have permission to change our minds, that no decision is permanent. And I think that’s why people get stuck in analysis paralysis, because you think you’re making a decision for the long term. And the people who don’t get stuck in that, who are decisive, are the people who are like, I am making a decision in this moment, and it’s okay if I change my mind later. I’m going to pick this URL for my business, and if I want to change it later, it’s fine. It’s actually not that hard to change your website URL. I’m going to just pick MailChimp as my email provider. And you know what, if I don’t like it, it’s fine. I’ll switch to flow desk later.
0:20:38
Megan Auman
People spend so much time researching those little things that don’t actually make that much of a difference, honestly. MailChimp, flow desk, Kajabi, whatever, they’re all fine. They all have their pros and cons. They all work great. You just pick one because you can always change it later in case anyone’s listening.
0:20:55
Tara Roskell
You don’t know what they are. They’re just mailing systems, aren’t they?
0:20:59
Megan Auman
Just yeah, they’re just mailing. But that’s a big one. People get our because email marketing is so key for a creative and I know so many people who are like, did you start your email list? Well, no, because I’m still trying to decide which one I want to use. Doesn’t matter, just pick one. It’s all fine. But always remembering that you just make a decision because you can change your mind later.
0:21:18
Tara Roskell
Sure. Can you share some tips or strategies for setting Achievable goals and for staying on track with productivity and progress?
0:21:27
Megan Auman
Yeah, so I think the biggest thing when setting goals is it’s more important to actually set actions and habits. So it’s really easy to set a goal of like, I want to do whatever it is and then not actually understand the steps to get there. And so when I think about goal setting, I always think about what are the tangible things that I can do? So instead of being like, I’m going to set a goal that I want to sell, I want my work to be in 20 stores by the end of the year. Instead saying, my goal is that I’m going to pitch five stores every week, whether that’s sending an email or sending a postcard, whatever it is. Because pitch five stores every week is something you have control over. And now it’s an action that’s going to bring you closer to theoretically, if you pitch five stores every week, hopefully by the end of the year, you’re in 20 stores.
0:22:14
Megan Auman
That’s a very doable goal. But just being like, I want to be in 20 stores, then you’re like, what do I do with that? So really thinking about, yes, this is what I want, but what are the actions and what are the habits? And then building those into your business. So looking at, are there tasks I’m going to do daily? Are there tasks I’m going to do weekly? Are there tasks I’m going to do monthly? And it really depends on you as a person. So some people really need very structured daily tasks. They’re like, if I don’t do this same thing every day, I’m not going to do it. Other people are like what I call creative hermits. Right? So you’re like, I’m going to go into the studio and in my bunker, and I’m not going to talk to anyone for the. Next three weeks. But then I’m going to come out. And when I come out of my bunker, I have set aside this week where I’m going to pitch 100 stores or I’m going to apply to all the shows or do all the things. And so you have to kind of know your personality there. But the most important thing is that you are setting goals.
0:23:07
Megan Auman
And then if you’re not doing the thing, then look at why you’re creating resistance. I like to say that willpower is a terrible business strategy because we actually have finite amounts of willpower every day. This is not my opinion. This is actual science. There have been studies about it. We only have so much willpower. And so if you’re giving yourself actions in your business that require a lot of willpower, you’re probably not going to do them over the long run. So an example that I give in the book, which also goes back to the perfectionist tendencies, is a woman I work with. She was like, oh, well, when I email a pitch to a store, I spend like half an hour triple checking that I’ve got the person’s name right.
0:23:48
Megan Auman
And I was like, just don’t put a name in. She was like, what? I can do that. I was like, yeah, if the simple putting a name into an email stresses you out, then just take it out and just send the email without the name. It’s fine, it’ll still feel personal, it’s all good. Or I have another woman that I work with who is like, english is not her native language, but she’s in the US. And she’s like, I just don’t feel comfortable writing. She’s like, I get really overwhelmed with writing, but she’s so good with visuals and she’s a fine artist. And so we talked about doing a lot of research to a lot of outreach to interior designers and art consultants. And she was like, I just can’t sit and send pitch emails. It doesn’t work for me. And I was like, great, then let’s design a beautiful postcard mailing that you can send out that’s really all about your visuals. You don’t have to sit there and try to write emails. So I think it’s really important to set actions and then if you fall through doing those actions, go back and ask yourself why.
0:24:44
Megan Auman
And then tweak them so that they fit more within your strengths.
0:24:48
Tara Roskell
That’s a good idea. And also everybody try and chuck GPT Now.
0:24:55
Megan Auman
That is definitely a sticking a sore point for me. I’m like, no, just right. But here’s the thing that I will say actually, about the writing piece is so many artists and makers feel like they have to do so much more writing than they actually do. Like use your images to sell your work. Use video. You don’t even have to talk. You can just use video to show motion or show detail or show scan across a painting you don’t have to write as much as you think you do.
0:25:27
Megan Auman
Most artists and makers spend too much time obsessing about their writing. 90% of your time should go into creating your visuals. 10% of your time should go into your writing.
0:25:35
Tara Roskell
Can you share any advice or tips for artists who want to turn their creative talents into a business?
0:25:41
Megan Auman
Yeah. So first things first, make sure you are priced appropriately. It is very easy to ignore all of the costs that go into a business. And so what ends up happening is you end up under pricing and then if things start to sell, you end up in burnout mode where it’s like hamster wheel of like I’m making the work and it’s selling, but why don’t I have any money? And it’s because you weren’t priced appropriately. So really understanding everything that goes into a business and everything that goes into pricing and making sure that you’re priced appropriately so that you aren’t like setting yourself up for again, I don’t like the word failure, but aren’t setting yourself up for a lot of unwanted stress and burnout going forward. And then the other thing is that I understand that when you are priced appropriately at the beginning, it can feel like you’re sort of expensive and then, so then your work is a little bit slow to sell and then you feel like you are struggling.
0:26:34
Megan Auman
And so one, you have to stay the course because if you are vastly undercharging for your work and then you go out and try to raise your prices, you’re going to realize that the audience that you originally cultivated is not the right audience anyway. So you have to stay the course even if it feels like, oh, I’m a little high. If you’ve done your math and you know your prices, that’s where you need to be. But then the other thing that I will add that I think is so important, and this is something I talk about a lot in artists and profit makers, which is my online mentorship program, is that you have to leverage other people’s audiences or as we call them in the group, OPA’s. So you mentioned this at the very beginning where you were saying that you started doing art fairs because you realized, like, if you sit on the internet, you’re just not getting feedback or you’re not getting the right feedback from the right people.
0:27:18
Megan Auman
And I think that’s the problem is we just think, oh well, if I just have my website and I post on social media, eventually these things should work, right? It’s like, no, that actually isn’t how it works. The businesses that grow, grow by leveraging other people’s audiences. And that could be doing art fairs or craft shows that could be selling to stores, it could be getting your work featured in the press, it could be doing podcasts interviews like this.
0:27:40
Megan Auman
It could be having influencers wear your work. And when I say influencers. I want to be clear here that I’m not talking about 20 something fashionistas, though. That can work if that’s your audience. But literally anyone else with a bigger or different audience than you, that’s an influencer. So in the early days of my business, one of my friends was also a business coach, and she would do a lot of teaching and a lot of speaking, and she would wear my jewelry on stage and in classes, and she would talk about me as an example in my work. Guess what? That’s an influencer. That’s someone who has influence wearing my work. Was she a 20 something fashionista? Absolutely not. But she wore my work, and she talked about my work, and it helps me build an audience. So if you are a visual artist, that could mean partnering with interior designers or art consultants. If you are a jewelry designer or make wearable products, that could literally mean giving your work to people to wear.
0:28:31
Megan Auman
If you make ceramics, it could be giving your mugs to people who might wear them or share them in their Instagram stories, whatever it is, not wear them. You can’t wear a mug, though. I’m a jewelry designer. Jewelry designers try to wear everything. If you don’t know this about us, like, if it’s about the size of your head, it’s a hat. You can stick your hand through it. It’s a bracelet. So I guess you’re not wearing a mug. But, man, jewelry designers are probably going to try.
0:28:58
Tara Roskell
Can I just get back to when you were talking about pricing? And I know you can’t go through the entire thing about pricing. Have you got one big tip for pricing? Is it about how long it takes you, or is it about looking at the market, seeing what the kind of general pricing?
0:29:14
Megan Auman
Yeah, so it’s a little bit of both of those. So here’s what I will say. Effective pricing is going to include four elements. It’s going to include your materials. It’s going to include your labor. So that’s how long it takes you to make something. And your labor should pay you a living wage for where you are. So in the US. There’s a great tool called the MIT living wage calculator but if you’re not in the US. Just Google where you live and living wage, and you should get an hourly rate.
0:29:39
Megan Auman
I recommend going above that to account for all the other time in your business that you can’t get paid for. So, like, design time, marketing time, all of that. But you at the very least, should not be below that living wage. So you’ve got your materials, you’ve got your labor, you’ve got your overhead, which is all the other expenses in your business, the marketing costs, the show fees, your computer, your studio set up, all of that stuff that you need.
0:30:04
Megan Auman
That’s your overhead. That has to go into your price. And then profit. Profit has to go in there as well. And that is that little bit of extra margin that you’ve got so that you’re not just operating at like break even pace, because that’s how you end up in burnout. So you’ve got those four elements, materials, labor, overhead, profit. Those together are your wholesale price, and then you double that to get your retail price.
0:30:28
Megan Auman
And the same thing, even if you’re a visual artist and you’re selling to galleries, wholesale is basically like your price that you would get from a gallery because they’re going to mark it up. You would get that 50% commission. So making sure all of that’s in there. But then when you do that, that is your bare minimum price. And so you can also look around at the marketplace. And so if you set a bare minimum price and you realize, oh, people are actually charging a lot more than that, then it gives you room to go up. You can actually raise your prices and go up even more. But you do have to be careful about what marketplace you’re looking at because what happens is a lot of people, they’ll go on Etsy or they’ll look at big box stores and they’ll say, my stuff is so high, like, I have to be lower.
0:31:08
Megan Auman
No, you can’t go to those artificially low marketplaces, and yes, Etsy is artificially low. You have to look at places where people are spending more money. Look at high end retail, look at high end art galleries, look at high end shops, high street, all those things. Look at all of that stuff and see what the potential is. I always tell people, go out and try to find the most expensive thing in your product category and just see what that is.
0:31:35
Megan Auman
But it starts with knowing your numbers and then looking at the marketplace from there.
0:31:39
Tara Roskell
Great. In your bio, you say you’ve got a really unique perspective on social media. And I’m quite curious about this, know more about this, that you were an early adopter of Instagram, but now you question it. Can you tell me more?
0:31:52
Megan Auman
Yeah. So when I first discovered Instagram and Instagram and Pinterest, I really had like a very similar reaction to both, which I was like, yes, finally, a visual platform. You know, this goes back to the whole, like, it’s trying not to spend all our time writing for stuff. You know, before that, I was on Twitter and I was like, everything was just about text. And I was like, no. As visual artists, we’re used to presenting our work visually. And I thought, great, these are platforms that finally, finally understand us. And so I was on Instagram really early, and I met a lot of great people through Instagram, and I still use Instagram.
0:32:25
Megan Auman
But the flip side is, one, we know that there’s a lot of unhealthy stuff that happens on Instagram where it really can have an impact on our mental health. And our sense of self and all of these things. So there is that challenge too. It’s just a freaking time suck, right? It’s amazing. You go on Instagram for like 3 seconds and then suddenly 2 hours later you’ve lost 2 hours. And so there’s that problem. And then now the challenge is as artists and makers, as small business owners, it’s really hard for our work to get seen there.
0:32:58
Megan Auman
But I think for me, my biggest issue with it is that in terms of marketing, it sucked all the air out of the room. So what happened was everyone was like, oh, here’s this platform where I can connect with my customers and they stopped doing any other marketing tasks. It’s like, oh well, I post on Instagram and I’m done. So why isn’t my business growing? It’s like, because Instagram alone and you could apply this to any social media platform.
0:33:21
Megan Auman
Instagram alone is not a marketing strategy. It is like a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny piece of the puzzle. And so if you’re serious about growing your business, you have to do all of this other stuff too. But it’s so easy to get sucked into focusing all of your time and energy on Instagram instead of doing the other work. And so that’s actually my biggest issue with it is that we are overly reliant on it, even though the return on investment of our time is so for the most part not worth it.
0:33:49
Tara Roskell
What would you suggest instead? Or is that just a two massive question to ask you?
0:33:55
Megan Auman
Yes. Okay, we’ll try to do it really quick. So number one, have your own website. Number two, and maybe even more important than number one, have an email list and encourage people to join your email list. And then actually email them regularly. Because at the end of the day, the email list is the audience you own. You don’t own Instagram followers, you don’t own TikTok followers, you don’t own Facebook followers, you don’t own any of those. And I’ve seen people who’ve literally had their entire Instagram and Facebook shut down for infractions that they didn’t even do because someone tried to hack them. So make sure you’ve got an email list so that you’ve got a way. And then if you are posting to Instagram or any other social platform, consistently remind people to join your email list. Put that sign up in your bio, make sure it’s really clear.
0:34:39
Megan Auman
Put that sign up link everywhere on your website. Get people on your email list so that is really important. If you can. I also recommend taking whatever images, whatever content you’re putting on Instagram and putting it somewhere else too. So like I put images on my blog, I also pin them to Pinterest. If you are someone who’s doing a lot of video, you might also choose to put that on YouTube, making sure that your content lives in other places besides Instagram.
0:35:06
Megan Auman
I always say if the only place you share an image is Instagram. You’ve wasted that image, put it other places as well. And then the last thing, which is the biggest marketing thing, especially in the beginning, is what we were just talking about those OPA’s, those other people’s. Audiences don’t just post on Instagram and hope someone’s going to find you, figure out what feels best for you. Is it doing retail shows? Is it selling to stores or having your work carried by galleries? Is it pitching the press? Is it working with influencers? And it might be some combination of all of those things, especially in the beginning, because you don’t know.
0:35:35
Megan Auman
But doing those things and being proactive and not just waiting for the Instagram algorithm gods to bless you, because chances are you’ll win the lottery first.
0:35:47
Tara Roskell
Yeah, definitely know what you mean by that. Now, many artists, including myself, struggle with self doubt, and that imposter Syndrome. Now, I don’t know if you still.
0:35:56
Megan Auman
Get this, but if you do, what.
0:35:59
Tara Roskell
Advice would you give to other artists?
0:36:02
Megan Auman
Yeah, so funny story about that. I have two degrees in metalsmithing, and it took me such a long time to call myself a metalsmith because it was a combination of when I was an undergrad. The joke was I was the metalsmithing major who never worked in metal. I was like hanging out in the fiber studio. I was doing all this alternative material stuff, like making things out of balloons and whatever, like all of this other stuff. And then when I got to grad school, I did eventually switch and started working more in metal, particularly in steel. But I went to grad school with two of the most technically skilled metalsmiths I have ever met in my life. And it absolutely made me feel inferior. And so coming out of school, I was like, I can’t call myself a metalsmith. Like, they’re a real metalsmith. I’m not a real metalsmith. I have two freaking degrees in it and I couldn’t do it. So impostor syndrome impacts everyone.
0:36:54
Megan Auman
Just understand that. It absolutely happens. But what I realized was, like a, within any field, everyone has different strengths. So my strengths were really in designing amazing repeatable production jewelry, which is actually a really hard skill. It’s why I teach a class in it. It’s actually a really hard skill. And so I had that skill. But I also realized that there’s no right or wrong path. So I think a lot of impostor syndrome comes from thinking that we don’t have the right background, right? Like, oh, well, they’re more technical than me, or, I didn’t go to school for this, or who am I to think that I’m worth this? But there really is no right path. Everyone comes to things differently.
0:37:37
Megan Auman
And so you are allowed to own whatever it is. And then I also think about how quickly other people will confer things on us that we won’t confer on ourselves. So I recently started baking. Like, I just got super into baking. And because I am like an all or nothing personality, instead of being like, I don’t know, I’m going to make some cookies or some cakes, I was like, I’m going to learn how to make the best croissant ever.
0:38:00
Megan Auman
And so I’ve been making croissants. I’ve only been baking for the last couple of months and it’s amazing how many people on Instagram and this is just me occasionally posting a picture of the croissants I’ve made in my stories. How many people are like sending me memes about croissants or sending me posts and being like, I thought of you. And the same thing happened when I started getting into house plants a few years ago. I was like, oh, suddenly Megan’s a plant lady.
0:38:22
Megan Auman
Everyone else around us is so much more quick to give us these titles that we won’t take on ourselves. And so I think it can be helpful to look at ourselves from other people’s eyes, right? How would other people see us? And chances are other people are going to say, you are a metalsmith. You are a plant lady. You are a croissant obsessed person. I don’t know what the adjective is for that. And so stop thinking and worrying about what the gatekeepers and industries put in because honestly, gatekeepers suck, right? Like gatekeeping is designed to keep everybody out. That’s not like a straight white man. So ignore the gatekeepers and think about how the people who love us view us. And those people are going to be like, yes, you’re an artist. Of course you’re an artist. Of course you’re a metalsmith. Of course you’re a plant lady. Those are the titles that those people are going to give us and so we should embrace those for ourselves.
0:39:17
Tara Roskell
So can you tell me a bit about your book, which I loved, like I said before, and also your coaching programs?
0:39:23
Megan Auman
Yeah. So my book is called Tried and See. Like I said, how to get shit done while over analyzing everything. It’s actually like a quick little book. It is available in paperback, in ebook, in audiobook. You can get it in my online store at shop Meganoman.com. For people who want the paperback but are not in the US. You can also buy it off of a certain big online retailer. I understand international shipping sucks, so I will not begrudge anyone who wants to buy it from there to avoid international shipping. But if you want the audio version, that is only available in my online store, so you can go there to get the audio version. If you would like to listen to me, read it to you in the studio because that I know is very important. So I also have since launched two other books. So one is the Arts and Profit Makers Guide to Selling to stores. So if you want to know more about wholesale, you can grab that and then I just did a book called Making Money Mindset and Marketing the Best of Designing an MBA, which is kind of like my best blog posts from 13 years of running my blog now.
0:40:21
Megan Auman
So those are all available in my online store at Shop Meganoman.com. And then on top of that, I run an online coaching program called Artists and Profit Makers, which is@artisandprofitmakers.com and that is really group coaching. We have an online forum that’s not a Facebook group. I cannot stand Facebook groups. It is our own private forum that’s just focused on going in there. People can ask questions, get feedback. I’ll literally do video reviews on people’s line sheets on their websites on all kinds of aspects. And then we also do a monthly training and a monthly Q and A. So I really wanted a place that was just for artists and makers, where I could focus, I could give a lot of attention, I could help cut through sort of like all that crap advice that doesn’t apply to us.
0:41:04
Megan Auman
And it’s a really wonderful supportive community. It’s been going started in 2018, so it’s been going strong for we’re just about to our five year anniversary. But yes, you can work with me there as well.
0:41:15
Tara Roskell
Just shows how productive you are. Two more books you’ve written as well.
0:41:19
Megan Auman
Yes, I have no chill, so actually that’s not true. I do try to relax a lot, but yeah, I put out a couple more because, I don’t know, I got really excited about books. I mean, I love books. I’ve always loved books, so that was kind of one of those big things for me. But, yeah, you can find those all on my website.
0:41:35
Tara Roskell
And your website is so you can.
0:41:37
Megan Auman
Go to Meganoman.com or you can go direct to the shop at Shop Meganoman.com, and you’ll find links to pretty much everything I do there.
0:41:45
Tara Roskell
And so what are your plans for the future? I’m guessing more books.
0:41:48
Megan Auman
Yes. So more books, for sure. I have a whole list of ideas of things that I’m working on. Potentially more online classes, too. I love writing online classes. More jewelry, more plants, more croissants, just a little bit more of everything.
0:42:06
Tara Roskell
So where can people find out more about you on your website, I assume is the main place?
0:42:11
Megan Auman
Yes. So if you go to Meganom.com, you can learn more about me, find all of my stuff, my jewelry, my books, my classes. Pretty much everything I have to offer is linked. From there, you can also scope my about page. And somewhere in there is a link to that wire chair I was talking about. You can get a little sneak peek of that. You can also find me on Instagram. As much as I begrudgingly, have my moments, I am still there. I do actively use it. So you can go look me up. I’m, Megan, amen on Instagram as well. I’m also Megan. Almond on pinterest. I like to hang out there as well, especially when I get sick of instagram.
0:42:48
Megan Auman
Hang on on pinterest for a little bit.
0:42:50
Tara Roskell
Is that just croissants, though, on there?
0:42:52
Megan Auman
No, actually it’s mostly plants. I’ll be totally honest. It’s mostly plants. My croissant board is that one’s private for some reason. Right now I have like one food board, but it’s a lot of plants at this moment and a lot of pictures of people with plants because I’m real into that. So you’ll find that there. I’m very active with that for the business as well. And then if you want to read more of my blog posts specifically related to business, you can go to designing an Mba.com.
0:43:19
Tara Roskell
It’s really funny. I was googling the other day because I was thinking, how can I make a panel for when I do this art show? I’m actually not going to do it now, but I saw a search. Who comes up? You? Yes.
0:43:31
Megan Auman
There is a video that I did about that.
0:43:35
Tara Roskell
How weird.
0:43:36
Megan Auman
That is super funny.
0:43:38
Tara Roskell
Yeah. Thank you so much. I mean, I’ve learned loads, so I’m hoping everybody else will. I’m sure they will, but yes. Thank you so much.
0:43:45
